President Stafford's response to Burt K1OIK

President Stafford's response to Burt K1OIK

Post by Burt » Sat, 04 Apr 1998 04:00:00

Mr. Stafford, I respect your position as President of the ARRL but frankly
based on what is written below, cut the crap. I have never been involved in
any VE session in which there was any question of "irregularity." I have
already sent my letter to several newspapers (and a few have said they will
or have published) but many more will follow. If I am reinstated, I will
stop.
Burt Fisher


> Dear Mr. Fisher,

> Whenever there is an irregularity in an ARRL-VEC test session, we are
> REQUIRED by our agreement with the FCC to suspend the VE credentials of
all
> ARRL VEs involved in that session.  We have no discretion along those
> lines.  When the FCC completes any investigation into the matter and
> informs us that they are satisfied that none of the ARRL VEs were
> responsible for the irregularity, then we will consider reinstatement.  No
> reinstatement of any ARRL VEs will occur until the FCC completes an
> investigation into the matter, if they chose to investigate.  The
> investigation is at their option and it is the responsibility of the FCC
to
> do, not the ARRL.

> Rod Stafford

 
 
 

President Stafford's response to Burt K1OIK

Post by K5p » Sun, 05 Apr 1998 04:00:00


Quote:

>Mr. Stafford, I respect your position as President of the ARRL but frankly
>based on what is written below, cut the crap. I have never been involved in
>any VE session in which there was any question of "irregularity."

Then why, Burt, did Stafford refer to irregularities? And what's your idea of
why you were suspended?  His letter indicated quite plainly that irregularities
were the issue.....
 
 
 

President Stafford's response to Burt K1OIK

Post by Peter Ma » Sun, 05 Apr 1998 04:00:00

       Reading literally, and without interpretation, the President's message
clearly states that irregularities are the issue.  That does not, however mean
that irregularities were present.  It only means that an issue has been made of
irregularities.  The FCC, therefore will conduct its investigation, and
determine whether irregularities in a given session were in fact involved in
the session, and conclude accordingly.  

        Both of you need to read what is being said, and understand the stated
message.  Burt's guilt or innocence is not foregone either way.  The President
has made no accusation, and the FCC is looking into the matter, as dictated by
procedure.  The suspension is SOP.   What IS clear, is that someone HAS accused
of irregularities, and that is what has triggered the automatic suspension and
inquiry.  

         Let the process determine its conclusion.   Protracted debate, and Mr
Fisher's noise is helping neither the investigation to conclude the truth, nor
his position with the ARRL VE program.  

         If it is not determined that Mr Fisher is guilty of wrongdoing, then
redress is in order against the party by whom the charges were made.  

         It may not seem like a fair system...but in truth it is.  The degree
to which anyone may have been wronged is dependent on the conclusion to which
the FCC investigators come.  

 
 
 

President Stafford's response to Burt K1OIK

Post by Peter Ma » Sun, 05 Apr 1998 04:00:00

     Again, until the investigation is concluded, no one has taken a hit.
Accusations, and insinuation, perhaps.  However, suspension of active duty in
the face of investigation is stock in trade in many areas of life.  

      I am aware of the current sentiment in the hobby toward ARRL.  And I
understand, if not condone,  many of their activities. However, allowing the
FCC to investigate, while they suspend the active status of Mr Fisher,
regardless of what we personally believe his value to the hobby to be, is
simply procedure.  

      The existence of any irregularity is the issue under investigation.
Conclusions either way, and their implications are premature.

       On the more  personal issues of trust in the regulatory bodies and their
impact upon your participation in the hobby or mine, you raise valid concerns.
I do not believe there is a totalitarian state of mind in the future of the
hobby, regardless of who oversees policy.  However, as has been the history of
this country, vigilance is always warranted.  The rights of the individual must
be protected from both the authority, and the majority.  
        Mr Fisher, may be on the short end of raw deal here.  But that has yet
to be determined.  Suspend judgement on both the motives and the guilt on
either side until the investigation is concluded.  And at that time, either
accept the conclusion of the investigating persons, or appeal them based on
unpresented evidence.  But to debate this now, raw deal or not, and to do it in
a vitriolic way, will neither help Mr Fisher's cause, nor our own as
individuals in the future of this hobby.  
         Your outrage is noted.  And it is further, understood.

 
 
 

President Stafford's response to Burt K1OIK

Post by Jeffrey Herm » Sun, 05 Apr 1998 04:00:00


>Mr. Stafford, I respect your position as President of the ARRL but frankly
>based on what is written below, cut the crap. I have never been involved in
>any VE session in which there was any question of "irregularity." I have
>already sent my letter to several newspapers (and a few have said they will
>or have published) but many more will follow. If I am reinstated, I will
>stop.
>Burt Fisher

Isn't that called extortion, Burt?


>> Dear Mr. Fisher,
>> Whenever there is an irregularity in an ARRL-VEC test session, we are
>> REQUIRED by our agreement with the FCC to suspend the VE credentials of
>> all ARRL VEs involved in that session.  We have no discretion along
>> those lines.  When the FCC completes any investigation into the matter
>> and informs us that they are satisfied that none of the ARRL VEs were
>> responsible for the irregularity, then we will consider reinstatement.  No
>> reinstatement of any ARRL VEs will occur until the FCC completes an
>> investigation into the matter, if they chose to investigate.  The
>> investigation is at their option and it is the responsibility of the FCC
>> to do, not the ARRL.
>> Rod Stafford

Make sure you include Mr. Stafford's informative letter when you contact
the the various newspapers, Burt.

Jeff KH2PZ
(.dx dropped from fol-ups)

 
 
 

President Stafford's response to Burt K1OIK

Post by Steve (KF2TI - Landing, » Sun, 05 Apr 1998 04:00:00


schemes...

> Mr. Stafford, I respect your position as President of the ARRL but frankly
> based on what is written below, cut the crap. I have never been involved in
> any VE session in which there was any question of "irregularity." I have
> already sent my letter to several newspapers (and a few have said they will
> or have published) but many more will follow. If I am reinstated, I will
> stop.
> Burt Fisher


> > Dear Mr. Fisher,

> > Whenever there is an irregularity in an ARRL-VEC test session, we are
> > REQUIRED by our agreement with the FCC to suspend the VE credentials of
> all
> > ARRL VEs involved in that session.  We have no discretion along those
> > lines.  When the FCC completes any investigation into the matter and
> > informs us that they are satisfied that none of the ARRL VEs were
> > responsible for the irregularity, then we will consider reinstatement.  No
> > reinstatement of any ARRL VEs will occur until the FCC completes an
> > investigation into the matter, if they chose to investigate.  The
> > investigation is at their option and it is the responsibility of the FCC
> to
> > do, not the ARRL.

> > Rod Stafford

ZZZZzzzzZZZZZzzzzZZZZZzzz  Huh??? what????

Did I miss something that really matters in the scheme of things??  Guess
not

Seems Fisher can't even read now, let alone fix electronics.  Looks like
he has to petition the FCC, not the ARRL.  Thta's great.  Given his
record of lies and slanders, this should at least get him an audience
before Kenneth Starr.  Go back to the shadows Burt, quite frankly, no one
gives a damn and you've only yourself to blame

 
 
 

President Stafford's response to Burt K1OIK

Post by Steve (KF2TI - Landing, » Sun, 05 Apr 1998 04:00:00



> >Mr. Stafford, I respect your position as President of the ARRL but frankly
> >based on what is written below, cut the crap. I have never been involved in
> >any VE session in which there was any question of "irregularity." I have
> >already sent my letter to several newspapers (and a few have said they will
> >or have published) but many more will follow. If I am reinstated, I will
> >stop.
> >Burt Fisher

> Isn't that called extortion, Burt?

Actually Jeff, it's a technique developed by one of Burt's friends,
Joesph Goerbels.  The use of lies and innuendo to get what you want.  
Burt professes hate for those types yet thinks of nothing to stoop to
their level.  Interesting isn't it?

Quote:> Make sure you include Mr. Stafford's informative letter when you contact
> the the various newspapers, Burt.

Just remember, we have no way of actually knowing whether or not this
letter was actually sent.  An interesting note is that all previous
correspondence has been via paper medium and yet this suddenly appears
via e-mail  Hmmmmm?  Given Burt's propensity to lie, I think this may be
another in series of fabrications from a very disturbed and certainly
juvenile mind
 
 
 

President Stafford's response to Burt K1OIK

Post by Constantine Thom » Sun, 05 Apr 1998 04:00:00


>Mr. Stafford, I respect your position as President of the ARRL but
frankly
>based on what is written below, cut the crap. I have never been
involved in
>any VE session in which there was any question of "irregularity." I
have
>already sent my letter to several newspapers (and a few have said they
will
>or have published) but many more will follow. If I am reinstated, I
will
>stop.
>Burt Fisher


>> Dear Mr. Fisher,

>> Whenever there is an irregularity in an ARRL-VEC test session, we
are
>> REQUIRED by our agreement with the FCC to suspend the VE credentials
of
>all
>> ARRL VEs involved in that session.  We have no discretion along
those
>> lines.  When the FCC completes any investigation into the matter and
>> informs us that they are satisfied that none of the ARRL VEs were
>> responsible for the irregularity, then we will consider
reinstatement.  No
>> reinstatement of any ARRL VEs will occur until the FCC completes an
>> investigation into the matter, if they chose to investigate.  The
>> investigation is at their option and it is the responsibility of the
FCC
>to
>> do, not the ARRL.

>> Rod Stafford

If the above was writen by the "El presidente" himself and he realy
believes the ARRL does something about BUYING and SELLING licenses, I
Chalenge him to do something about N1IVP and his wifes' license.
N1IVP told me, yes I can aford it and i bought two, one for me one for
my wife.
For the record N1IVP got his license in Faifield CT.
WA1WLA
 
 
 

President Stafford's response to Burt K1OIK

Post by WK1V » Sun, 05 Apr 1998 04:00:00

I am curious though....did any other VE's of this alleged irregular session have
their credentials suspended?

Jim Martin, WK1V
_________________________




> >      Again, until the investigation is concluded, no one has taken a hit.
> > Accusations, and insinuation, perhaps.  However, suspension of active duty
> in> the face of investigation is stock in trade in many areas of life.

> I can understand that but get this, in my case there is no accusation, try
> and find where President Stafford has made any connection to anything
> whatsoever. No group I have EVER been associated with had had ANY problem
> whatsoever.

 
 
 

President Stafford's response to Burt K1OIK

Post by WK1V » Sun, 05 Apr 1998 04:00:00

Did Mr. Fisher receive any correspondance from the FCC?  In it's statement to Mr.
Fisher that his VE credentials were suspended, did the ARRL forward said FCC
correspondance to him?  Although I am not on his defense team shouldn't EVERYONE
deserves to hear it from the horse's mouth?  Yes, the ARRL is the VE Coordinator and
I am not made privy to the whole story, but there seems to be some questions
remaining...namely the WHY of it...I mean...where is the evidence?  Shouldn't Burt
be told the whole story?  He may be a blight to amateur radio within the newsgroups
(and elsewhere for that matter) but doesn't he have rights?  What if this was one of
us?  It could just have well as been...

73,

Jim Martin, WK1V
____________________________



> >       Reading literally, and without interpretation, the President's message
> >clearly states that irregularities are the issue.  That does not, however mean
> >that irregularities were present.  It only means that an issue has been made of
> >irregularities.  The FCC, therefore will conduct its investigation, and
> >determine whether irregularities in a given session were in fact involved in
> >the session, and conclude accordingly.

> No I think YOU need to read it again Peter.

> Stafford clearly states that IF the FCC investigates the
> "irregularity".

> Then he says the decision to investigate is the FCC's not the ARRL.

> Doesn't sound like ANY investigation is going on to me.

> In light of the total lack of standards inforcement on the bands, do
> you think they even care enough to investigate something like this?

> What it sounds like to me is a description of a Catch 22.

> You are suspended until the investigators make a report, but we don't
> do the investigating and none is taking place, so no report.

> For the record Burt has shown himself to be a blight on Amateur radio
> and I hate to even come close to his defense.

> However, I personally want the faceless bureaucrats at the FCC making
> the decisions about the way things should be.

> I do not want the old boys club at the ARRL making regulatory
> decisions for Amateur radio.

> Though this instance is minor and has no real bearing on you or I
> Peter, rest assured the ARRL sees the light at the end of the tunnel
> and they are ready,willing and salivating at the prospect of the FCC
> getting out of the Amateur radio business so they can step in and fill
> the void.

> Blackballing like this is just a small step in the process and it WILL
> get worse.

> Today it is "Burp" taking a hit, tomorrow it is you or me Peter
> because we don't subscribe to some ARRL dogma

> 73