What am I missing?

What am I missing?

Post by Robert Lyon » Sat, 22 Mar 2003 12:43:03

OK, I know very little about the cell phones in general, and less
about Nextel "two-way radio" phones, especially. I am, however,
really baffled about some relatively recent adverti***ts for
those phones that make no sense to me.

The television commercial starts out with someone getting off an
airplane, then goes to a split-screen with two scenarios of that
one person - in one, the guy tries to call someone on his cell
phone to get a ride home. No answer. He struggles through the
rain to a taxi, and life gets worse from there for the poor luck-
less guy with an ordinary cell phone.

On the other side of the split screen, the same person has a
Nextel two-way radio phone. The party they "radio" immediately
answers, and rushes out to rescue the weary traveller. Life
is rosy, and all because he had a Nextel and used the two-way
feature.

Huh???

I ask you: Why the heck would someone with a "two-way radio"
phone be any more likely to reach the party they are calling???
Seems like raw BS to me. Or am I missing something? IS there any
advantage to those dumb things at all?

73 - Bob, KI8AB

 
 
 

What am I missing?

Post by Joe Leikhi » Sat, 22 Mar 2003 13:43:54


More marketing BS. You are just as likely to be in an area where NEXTEL
service sucks, or the other party isn't there to answer the phone.


> OK, I know very little about the cell phones in general, and less
> about Nextel "two-way radio" phones, especially. I am, however,
> really baffled about some relatively recent adverti***ts for
> those phones that make no sense to me.

> The television commercial starts out with someone getting off an
> airplane, then goes to a split-screen with two scenarios of that
> one person - in one, the guy tries to call someone on his cell
> phone to get a ride home. No answer. He struggles through the
> rain to a taxi, and life gets worse from there for the poor luck-
> less guy with an ordinary cell phone.

> On the other side of the split screen, the same person has a
> Nextel two-way radio phone. The party they "radio" immediately
> answers, and rushes out to rescue the weary traveller. Life
> is rosy, and all because he had a Nextel and used the two-way
> feature.

> Huh???

> I ask you: Why the heck would someone with a "two-way radio"
> phone be any more likely to reach the party they are calling???
> Seems like raw BS to me. Or am I missing something? IS there any
> advantage to those dumb things at all?

> 73 - Bob, KI8AB

--
Joe Leikhim K4SAT

"Jazz is not dead.  It just smells funny." -F.Z.

 
 
 

What am I missing?

Post by Leigh W3NL » Sat, 22 Mar 2003 23:58:48

You're not missing anything.  It's all marketing BS.

73 de Leigh W3NLB

On Thu, 20 Mar 2003 22:43:03 -0500, Robert Lyons


>OK, I know very little about the cell phones in general, and less
>about Nextel "two-way radio" phones, especially. I am, however,
>really baffled about some relatively recent adverti***ts for
>those phones that make no sense to me.

>The television commercial starts out with someone getting off an
>airplane, then goes to a split-screen with two scenarios of that
>one person - in one, the guy tries to call someone on his cell
>phone to get a ride home. No answer. He struggles through the
>rain to a taxi, and life gets worse from there for the poor luck-
>less guy with an ordinary cell phone.

>On the other side of the split screen, the same person has a
>Nextel two-way radio phone. The party they "radio" immediately
>answers, and rushes out to rescue the weary traveller. Life
>is rosy, and all because he had a Nextel and used the two-way
>feature.

>Huh???

>I ask you: Why the heck would someone with a "two-way radio"
>phone be any more likely to reach the party they are calling???
>Seems like raw BS to me. Or am I missing something? IS there any
>advantage to those dumb things at all?

>73 - Bob, KI8AB

 
 
 

What am I missing?

Post by Robert Lyon » Sun, 23 Mar 2003 02:25:15

 > On Thu, 20 Mar 2003 22:43:03 -0500, Robert Lyons
 >
 >
<<...>>
 >>I ask you: Why the heck would someone with a "two-way radio"
 >>phone be any more likely to reach the party they are calling???
 >>Seems like raw BS to me. Or am I missing something? IS there any
 >>advantage to those dumb things at all?


> You're not missing anything.  It's all marketing BS.

> 73 de Leigh W3NLB

I got one private response who claimed that these things don't even relay
through a cell tower that they are true two-way radios. Sounds wrong to
me, though - it was my understanding that they claim a 300 *mile* radius
of operation. There's no way that would be true for handheld microwave
devices unless they use a tower-based relay (or a whole network of them).

Can anyone confirm whether the two-way radio feature operates via relay
tower? or whether these devices are *capable* of direct unit-to-unit
communications?

On a related vein, are many current police two-way radios capable of direct
car-to-car communications? Do they generally depend on a central repeater?
Are they completely out of luck when the central tower goes down? or are
some police systems more flexible and failure-resistant?

Bob, KI8AB

 
 
 

What am I missing?

Post by Al » Sun, 23 Mar 2003 05:03:31

They work great. See Murray Fleece, he has illegal amps for sale to broaden
coverage.


Quote:> OK, I know very little about the cell phones in general, and less
> about Nextel "two-way radio" phones, especially. I am, however,
> really baffled about some relatively recent adverti***ts for
> those phones that make no sense to me.

> The television commercial starts out with someone getting off an
> airplane, then goes to a split-screen with two scenarios of that
> one person - in one, the guy tries to call someone on his cell
> phone to get a ride home. No answer. He struggles through the
> rain to a taxi, and life gets worse from there for the poor luck-
> less guy with an ordinary cell phone.

> On the other side of the split screen, the same person has a
> Nextel two-way radio phone. The party they "radio" immediately
> answers, and rushes out to rescue the weary traveller. Life
> is rosy, and all because he had a Nextel and used the two-way
> feature.

> Huh???

> I ask you: Why the heck would someone with a "two-way radio"
> phone be any more likely to reach the party they are calling???
> Seems like raw BS to me. Or am I missing something? IS there any
> advantage to those dumb things at all?

> 73 - Bob, KI8AB

 
 
 

What am I missing?

Post by Joe Leikhi » Mon, 24 Mar 2003 04:07:49

Bob;
The NEXTEL radios will only work when each are in range of NEXTEL towers. The
term "direct connect" is a misnomer. They do not have simplex/talk-around
capability, nor will they operate with a conventional repeater. They are TDMA
only no FM capability is offered in those radios. Although the technology
exists to combine these modes, due to their respective marketing strategies,
Motorola and NEXTEL have chosen not to offer a radio with these combined
functions.

Public Safety radios are supposed to meet APCO-16 standards at a minimum.
APCO-16 requires (among other things) the radios to be capable of operating on
conventional simplex (talk around) and duplex (repeater) modes in addition to
trunked modes. This is for interoperability purposes and to a lesser extent
provides back up communications in the event users are out of range of the
"system" or the tower fails.

Public Safety systems are constructed to provide a level of equipment
redundancy and signal reliability that would not be economical to the
commercial market which NEXTEL serves.

NEXTEL radios should NOT be used for public safety communications (I will
probably get flamed for saying this).

Joe


> (snip)

> I got one private response who claimed that these things don't even relay
> through a cell tower that they are true two-way radios. Sounds wrong to
> me, though - it was my understanding that they claim a 300 *mile* radius
> of operation. There's no way that would be true for handheld microwave
> devices unless they use a tower-based relay (or a whole network of them).

> Can anyone confirm whether the two-way radio feature operates via relay
> tower? or whether these devices are *capable* of direct unit-to-unit
> communications?

> On a related vein, are many current police two-way radios capable of direct
> car-to-car communications? Do they generally depend on a central repeater?
> Are they completely out of luck when the central tower goes down? or are
> some police systems more flexible and failure-resistant?

> Bob, KI8AB

--
Joe Leikhim K4SAT

"Jazz is not dead.  It just smells funny." -F.Z.

 
 
 

What am I missing?

Post by Geoffrey S. Mendels » Mon, 24 Mar 2003 05:31:08


> I ask you: Why the heck would someone with a "two-way radio"
> phone be any more likely to reach the party they are calling???
> Seems like raw BS to me. Or am I missing something? IS there any
> advantage to those dumb things at all?

Bob, it's very simple. You get off the airplane turn on your cell phone
and ... oops no coverage or an overloaded network. There goes your
phone call. What do you do? Reach in your bag, get out your HT and
use the local 2m repeater to make a phone call.

The Nextel service is the same idea except that the phone combines
an 800 mHz trunked radio with a cell phone. These days most companies
are moving away from 800mHz trunked radio to cell phones as they give
better deals on airtime. So the 800mHz repeaters are often underused.

Here in Israel, Motorola owns an 800 mHz trunked network that was so
underused they started selling phones for it and marketing as a cell
phone service called "Amigo". It's not a cell phone service, it's
trunked radio, but the user can't tell the difference.

The local cell phone companies sued saying they were operating
an unlicensed cell phone network. The court ruled that it was
trunked radio, no matter how they packaged it and they were
allowed to sell it.

Geoff.
--

Do sysadmins count networked sheep?